Original-Cin Q&A: The makers of Boys State - in which politically opposed teens show adults how to govern - tout their Sundance winning doc
Boys State is a character-driven Sundance-winning Hot Docs film that takes an intimate look at an elaborate American Legion program, in which 1,000 high school seniors assemble at the Texas state Capitol, create their own mock government and campaign for the highest office at Texas Boys State—governor.
Our Bonnie Laufer spoke with husband and wife directors Jesse Moss and Amanda McBaine about this eye opening documentary.
Boys State, winner of this year’s Sundance Grand Jury Prize and an official selection of Hot Docs 2020, will make its international premiere at Hot Docs on Sunday, June 21, with a free streaming event for Hot Docs members. The film will start streaming that afternoon at 4:30 p.m. and will end at 6:30 p.m. with a live Q&A with directors Amanda McBaine and Jesse Moss.
Tickets are available to members on a first-come, first-served basis starting today at hotdocs.ca. Become a member at hotdocs.ca/members.
Steven Garza, an immigrant aspirant for teen “Governor,” turns out to be a natural politician and speaker.
ORIGINAL-CIN: I was absolutely fascinated by this film and completely unaware that this even goes on. Especially being Canadian, the first thing I did was Google to see if we have political-prep events for teens here in Canada. How did you find out about Boys State and then decide to make this documentary showing the whole process?
JESSE MOSS: “We didn't participate in the program growing up. I didn't know about it as a kid or as a teenager.
“I guess I first learned about it was when I saw a picture of President Bill Clinton - or he was then a candidate - as a boy in the Rose Garden shaking JFK's hand. He had been sent to Washington as part of the Boys’ National program and I made a note of this interesting program.
“I didn't think about it again quite honestly until 2017 when I read an article in the Washington Post about how Texas Boys State had voted to secede from the Union shortly after Donald Trump’s election, and this vote became a national news story. We thought it was really interesting and wanted to know more about how these events work and how the boys maneuvered the political system.”
OC: This was a huge undertaking and especially since you covered it from beginning to end to follow the entire process. I can't even imagine first of all what was going through both your heads. How many cameras did you have and how did you get through the editing process?
AMANDA McBAINE: “ We've learned over our lifetime, both as parents and also as filmmakers - cInema verite filmmakers in particular - we knew we needed to find most of the kids who we were going to follow through this experience beforehand, and not cast on the fly. The event moves too quickly and it would have been crazy.
“So we spent about three months first trying to call people of the 1000 kids we could choose from. We had to obviously whittle it down to a much smaller group and that was not super effective. So we ended up getting a car and driving around Texas and filming in people's houses and meeting people.
Filmmakers Amanda McBaine and Jesse Moss
“But the minute we met the four people we ended up focusing on in the film we kind of knew right away they were going to be our guys.”
OC: I would think you were especially trying to find a few of the guys who knew they were going to run for Governor?
McBAINE: “We had a good sense of who wanted to try out to be a governor. They were really ambitious kids, and politically savvy. We needed a diverse group and we needed them to represent different ends of the political spectrum. We needed them to have different backgrounds, but we knew that we needed them to be ambitious.”
MOSS: “ It was important that we were going to be inspired by these guys and follow their process. We had to put together a very big crew, there were about 28 people. It was closer to a fiction film set in scope and size. But we had seven crews deployed at any one time tracking characters. It was a really wild experience and by the end of it we both felt like we went through Boys State and are now alumni of the program!”
OC: Would you even think about running for a political position after having gone through this process or did it completely turn you off of politics?
MOSS: “I think it was such an extraordinary vantage point on the process of political elections. I think that because they're young men, they were sort of vulnerable at trying things out.
“If we were to make a campaign film about a real candidate as it were, there's so many more restrictions and you can only look in one direction and this kind of allowed us to go everywhere and anywhere.
“It was really eye opening getting to know these boys and they really surprised us. They wrestled with hard questions, questions all political figures wrestle with and after it was all said and done it was a real learning and eye opening experience for us both.”
OC: For the most part the boys you decide to focus on were intelligent, passionate and pretty inspiring. But of course you have to show both sides, all opinions matter. There was one young man named Rene who really impressed me, but he wasn't initially somebody that you had found when you did your scouting?
McBAINE: “You're right. He's the one person we did not find before we started. You meet him in the film the way that we met him. He is a fantastic person and such a great speaker.
“There's a natural talent to be able to write a speech like he does in the film and to be able to stand on the stage and give a speech without any hesitation. It was exciting to watch his growth over the week and we were so happy that we found him. He added something very special to the film.”
OC: There were so many impressive young men who you focused on. Stephen Garza who came from an Immigrant background, who we really grew to love. And then there's Ben Feinstein, who I am still on the fence about! Who ultimately impressed you or maybe surprised you the most?
MOSS: “I think to make a documentary like this, you really end up getting very attached to your subjects. I wouldn't say that I agree politically with all of our subjects, but I think we did fall in love with all four of those boys.
“Stephen definitely stole our hearts. My heart was with him before the event started and he really impressed us. He is a very sophisticated soulful person, but maybe not necessarily an obvious great candidate. So when he gives a tremendous speech, (I don't want to spoil too much), we had no idea that he could speak and connect with people like that.
“Earlier, you mentioned the edit process. It took a week to shoot the film but a year to edit. We kind of knew who the characters were. But I think that we felt so moved by the whole experience, particularly watching Stephen and his journey. We wanted the audience to feel that emotion, feel like they were there with us and we knew we had to find that in the edit room.”
OC: There's so much that went on. And most importantly you had to show boys who had strong opinions on things like abortion, gun control and so many issues we are facing right now. While it was inspiring to see the passion in these boys, it’s also scary because some of them have some pretty far right opinions.
MOSS: “It's really deadly serious business. The health of our democracy was really what this film is about. But at the same time it also made us laugh making this film.
“I know it's not a time of humor right now. But I think to give you a film that can make people feel deeply, to cry and to laugh is really what we aspire to as documentary filmmakers. That's what we found there at Boys State, the highs, the lows, the crazy energy, the idealism of throwing yourself into a process.
“I think the deep inspiring message for us is, whether you agree with someone like Ben's politics or not, he throws himself in. I mean who has a Ronald Reagan doll on his book shelf? Well, not me, but I kind of admire him for his convictions and political talents. But I also fear him.
“So I think if there's a lesson to the movie, it really is don't take democracy for granted and throw yourself in there. In America and Canada, we have a great potential for moral leadership. We are seeing young people showing up every day on the streets, protesting, making their voices heard. I think to some extent we adults have left them a tough situation to figure out but I have faith in that generation.“
OC: I’m glad you brought it back around to Ben, because there was one line that Rene says near the end of the film that really stood out for me. Speaking about Ben he says, ‘I don't hate the man. I think he's a fantastic politician. But I don't think that being a fantastic politician is a compliment either.”
McBAINE: “There's always going to be a duality. We see the bad, but we hope for the good, and you're always doing that dance. I think that's going to have to be where it is for a while. People without principles can lead us to a very dangerous place and I feel like to some extent that's where we are now in our world.”
MOSS: “ I feel like that's what Rene is saying, you might be a brilliant politician, and some might say that our current President is that. But I'm not so sure about his principles.
“Let's hope that in the future we get leaders who are both good at politics and have good principles. Certainly with the young men that we met over the course of making this movie, we did find some of that and that made us hopeful for the future.”